Something doesn’t add up?
by HeadCase on Aug.04, 2006, under Philosophical
Heres a fun philosophy excercise. As some of you may or may not know the classic "Ship of Theseus" replacement paradox scenario. Here is my version of it and how it may address identity issues.
Lets say, there is an island, lets call it the La isla HeadCase "HeadCase Island". So, in this island, there reigned a pretty demented King, we’ll call him King Case. So, under the rule of King Case, people were very happy in general. Every weekend, he gave away free alcohol to his loyal drunk subjects. Eventhough poverty stricken and starving, the peasants had a helluva time drinking and partying their asses off. So when King Case passed away peacefully in a drunken rage. The people missed him dearly and built a ship in his name. We’ll call it, the Ship of Case. The good people would take the ship out every year and drink themselves blind in memory of their beloved alco-king.
Over the years, the Ship of Case suffered wear and tear (you know how drunks are) and parts were replaced… plank by plank, sails, etc. All the used parts were dumped on a beach not to far off from where the Ship of Case was kept at the pier.
One fine day, some young kid comes along and finds all these ship parts on the beach (waste disposal isn’t exactly a priority to a nation of alcoholics). So this kid found that there were enough used parts to make a ship. So after weeks of hard work, he built a ship which looks exactly like the Ship of Case that is parked at the pier. So here it is, which is the Ship of Case?
The ship by the beach built by that kid with all the original parts? or the ship by the pier that had been completely replaced with new parts?
Think about this, and then think about how it applies to us.
131 Comments for this entry
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August 23rd, 2006 on 2:18 am
So i guess if we made an army of clones named Yuehan, they are all exactly the same?
August 23rd, 2006 on 4:30 am
hi can i b ur frend???bcoz i lke u
August 23rd, 2006 on 5:13 am
everyone has different point of views ^_^
August 23rd, 2006 on 11:02 pm
halohah i just want to say how are u now?
August 23rd, 2006 on 11:22 pm
i agree to some extent of what you have written… but i can guide you further .. take a look at my friendster account
August 23rd, 2006 on 11:34 pm
whatever it is… it reproduces same.. from being used to nothing then to something…
August 23rd, 2006 on 11:35 pm
whatever it is… it reproduces same.. from being used to nothing then to something…
August 24th, 2006 on 2:28 am
This is a case in point of the philosophy of the human body and mind.The ship being the metaphor for the human person.In my opnion,the answer is neither because the original ship of case is not the one in the pier nor the one repaired by the people.Both can qualify to be called the ship of case but such a deduction would be imprecise.Like the ship, the human person is in the process of ‘becoming’. He/she would be that person of the past but to conclude that he/she is the same as that ’someone’ he/she had been would be inaccurate.Its a paradox…which makes life a bit more beautiful.
August 24th, 2006 on 8:46 am
Nice. A good read. I’m sure some people might interprete it differently but I suppose that the ship with the old parts isn’t really the Ship of Case. Everything and everyone changes, and at some point of time we leave parts of us behind so that we can adjust to our current environment. Come to think of it this is very open to interpretation. For me, I’ve always believed that although we are deeply affected by our past experiences, we should take a person for what he IS and not what he WAS. People change constantly, as do their surroundings. Looking at the ship the boy made from the old parts we can tell what the ship WAS like but it’s not really the Ship of Case. Though we do get a rough idea of what it might be like now. I am what I am today, as for tomorrow we’ll have to wait and see. A very thoughtful read indeed. Good job.
August 24th, 2006 on 9:51 am
IMHO,
the new ship was built out of curiousity. It does not reflect the original purpose.
the new body was built from the shadows of the old one, (which all must pass in due time)—> where the memory of alco-king gets reminisced.
it’s a matter of purpose. it’s all about purpose that pushes us to do things.
for whatever we do, however we do it, there is always an underlying purpose.
August 24th, 2006 on 7:31 pm
Lessee…
have two shoeboxes. label one ’ship on the pier’ and the other ’ship the boy built’…
get 4 small wooden blocks. label each as ‘original ship of case part’ then place in ’ship on the pier’ box.
each morning, get one ‘original ship of case part’ block from ’ship on the pier’ box and put it into the ’ship the boy built’ box. then replace the block you took from ’ship on the pier’ box with another small block, this time label it as ‘replacement part for ship of case’. do this again for three days.
guess what is in the ’ship the boy built’ box…
August 25th, 2006 on 3:42 am
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August 26th, 2006 on 5:25 am
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August 26th, 2006 on 7:43 am
hi
August 26th, 2006 on 10:59 pm
Hell, I would love to live in a country like that. free alcohol for loyal subjects.
Without a doubt, the Ship of Case is THE ship used by the late king’s subjects to celebrate in drunken stupor in honour of him years after years.
August 27th, 2006 on 12:55 am
haaaayyyyyy……
August 27th, 2006 on 7:21 am
haaaayyy… how i wish that there is someone who will make me feel good today…!! 2 ol my frndz out there paramdam naman kayo oohhh………
August 27th, 2006 on 7:26 am
hi……. how are you today????
August 27th, 2006 on 9:47 am
An object is not only defined by its material or its looks. There also is the purpose, and in a way, a spirit. The second ship has the same appearance but was built with completely different intentions. There is only one original. The first one.
August 27th, 2006 on 6:57 pm
This is interesting. To pick one or the other is indeed like making an ultimatum. The “old” ship represents the fundamental/up bringing/the origin of a person and the “new” ship is the person today. And the person today is moulded by the earlier years. This new person could have well evolved into a better person, or vice versa. Instead of picking the old ship or the new ship, here’s another thought to ponder: There is no right or wrong answer though it is what the individual makes out of it. All things are relative.
August 27th, 2006 on 8:30 pm
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August 28th, 2006 on 12:15 am
Hello there i am looking for a nice friend out there i am lonely…..
August 28th, 2006 on 12:54 am
Hi casey just wanted to be your friend…..
August 28th, 2006 on 2:33 am
hai, kamu siapa???????????
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ferra_chan
August 28th, 2006 on 5:20 am
we are not really talking here about the ship its one person evolving into a better one, what we were and what we have become is one whole person. to ignore the past is to invalidate the present. we are whole if we embrace our past and present. the paradox of life…we take the good and the bad, the old and the new…the nice and the naughty….nyahahaha…enjoy your life!!!
August 30th, 2006 on 8:17 am
Well, if you ask me, none of the ships is the ship of case.Because, figuring all those people were drunkards, the main value of the ship of case has been forgotten. If the ship of case was really important, it should have been preserved and kept sacred by the drunkards-though I don’t know if they even know what sacred is, better yet keep it sacred- because it was built in memory of the King. Seeing as they neglected the essence and the sacredness of the ship, then the purpose of the ship is then nothing more than
illusions.
The old ship-uh-parts- are merely a sight for sore eyes for the people who are allergic to mess.
Yeah.
And the boy who rebuilt the old parts of the ship has his own purpose in building it, therefore, that ship could not be the ship of case because it lacks the purpose of considering it sacred for Case.
It’s really quite simple, A ship or any other object can have the name, but then without the purpose, it couldn’t be that thing anymore. It’s merely a vessel for the name and not the real thing because the essence or purpose doesn’t exist.
August 31st, 2006 on 5:59 am
NOne of the Two..the real ship is in the mind. The two ship was just a representation of the ship of case. Just like in philosophy when ask what is a “chair” you simply point out to a chair, a bench or anything to sit in….but the “real” chair exist only in the mind. In philosophy ” to be perceived is to exist” just like the ship of case its existence lies on the perception of the people. In real life everything around us is just a representation of what we think existing if we stop thinkin bout it would cease to exist. Get?! thats all…..
August 31st, 2006 on 11:45 pm
That’s easy, The Ship of Case is the old one that used by the good people would take the ship out every year and drink themselves blind in memory of their beloved alco-king . The material is irrelevant.
November 22nd, 2006 on 1:37 am
the original ship built by the kids is the real ship of case. Well, The first one is always the original. If your beloved cat died, and you cloned it, would you still love the clone just like the way you once loved your beloved cat?
February 7th, 2007 on 6:37 pm
brilliant mind…i had a nice time reading your writings…=)
March 10th, 2008 on 8:44 pm
The ship by the pier is the Ship of Case. A person will not change his/her identity just because of replacing certain parts of the body or donating organs to another and vice-versa.